FreeSVG community discussion forum

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

[Feature] NSFW tag

Some images may be NSFW so it may be nice to have a way to flag them and then perhaps require a click to show the preview or a user setting.

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Hi Liftarn, from what I understand the long term objective is to make the site completely child friendly with the help of community members screening so the hope is there should be no images or text deemed to be inappropriate, the new red button found at the bottom/side of each image named "report issues", is multi function, one of the options available is to report as in appropriate.

I am aware pixabay use a different mechanism for their site, as inappropriate images are omitted from view until the user accepts them, I doubt that method would be adopted by the webdevs as there would be little point in having such images.

Last I knew the webdevs were working on a policy for handling uploaders of inappropriate content, they mentioned possibly using a 3 strike policy: notify a user their image/s / text have been flagged as in appropriate and removed, given them the chance to reupload or change the content to make it more suitable for children, repeat offenders will be warned, then eventually removed, It was rough around the edges when first mentioned, so I am not sure how far they have got with it, or when / if it will be enforced.

Still it was a good idea though, keep them coming.

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Hi Liftarn, from what I understand the long term objective is to make the site completely child friendly

OK, that would mean that a lot of art, anatomical illustrations et.c. may be deleted.

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

I haven't came across images of that nature, I am sure there may be some floating around, and whether they remain on the site depends on firstly it being flagged by another user, and secondly whether the Webdevs on moderating the image also agree that it should be censored in so way, personally I think removal of those type of images would have little impact on visitor numbers, and in any event the request an image in the forum, could serve to fill the gap, so people could exchange those images offsite privately. Obviously if there were public uproar then it could be up for review.

Ultimately, the decision lies with the dev's and what their current stance is towards it, they might decided to go with accepting images of that nature, or instead some age verification for registered users to allow viability of those type of images, only once a person has confirmed their age, and are logged in. let's wait and see their response to the suggestion.

vedran

Moderator

Registered: 2019-09-21

Posts: 77

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

We need to thing about possible solutions. It would be a shame to omit some SVGs if there is possibility to keep them.
For now please just report them with report button

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

I haven't came across images of that nature, I am sure there may be some floating around,

And some just turned up:
https://freesvg.org/reves-du-matin
https://freesvg.org/silhouette
https://freesvg.org/women-silhouette

They are (sort of) NSFW, but should not be deleted as they are useful.

Last edited by liftarn (2019-11-07 10:17:36)

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Point taken but keep in mind:
Yesterday I referred a user to the site from twitter, and soon after seen this comment appear in the flagged images panel, this was in relation to a provocative smiley image that had been posted to the site, looking at the users twitter profile they seem to have had a connection to a school board district of texas, which could have lead to thousands of unique visitors to the site, and who knows how many further contributions added, so yes it would be great to keep all images, and make them available to everyone, but there is consequences in doing so.

"
OK, not exactly explicit content, but we'd love to send students to this site. With a graphic like this, we, as a school district, can't recommend students using this site. BTW- such an awesome site! Thank you!
"

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

although it pains me to say it, purhaps a check box, available to those submitting an image or retagging those from the OCAL collection that identifies the image as needing age verification. It should also prevent provocative images making it to the home screen in the first place.

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

I guess you are talking about https://freesvg.org/admin/blogs/90854/edit
I don't see why that would be considered so offensive.

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

It's considered a rude hand gesture here in the UK, which could under some circumstances get you in a lot of trouble, I've known people lose their jobs for less. I think in this context it not that it's overtly offensive, it's because it's something that could be imitated by a child and used towards towards parents or teachers, which goes against social eticate, and if left unchecked could develop into further behaviour problems, if every time I met a person and they did this to me, my instinct might be to treat them as an outcast, so this is why children are conditioned with positive social norms, so they fit into society.

Of course the argument can be made that sheltering children from this type of thing has little effect, it certainly didn't harm me as a child but I understand the need to err on the side of caution, as we have all seen the aftermath of children that were socially isolated or rejected by society in some way, some people cope with it, others go off the rails and inflict harm on others.

Blown out of context, maybe but who knows for sure.

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Wow, that way way blown out of context. I understand the gesture, but to think an emoticon flipping the bird would cause a child to become a serial killer seems unlikely. I find the censorship more troubling. If we censor this harmless figure then we open up a very large can of worms. Are FreeSVG going to bow down to every request to censor something that someone may find offensive?

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

oh really, Jeffrey Dahmer & Ed Gein both admitted started off flipping the bird... only joking, they didn't I did state it was blown out of context, but there must be a reason the powers that be don't permit the publishing of childrens books that contain emoji flipping the bird, and I don't even recall seeing this type of emoji being available in android messaging either, so I trust they have done their homework.

Like I say, we will have to see what the WebDevs decide, some of the clipart posted recently from the back catalogue is bordering on Obscene and some may be seen as offensive to some, to so it's definitely something that needs to be tackled at some point.

talljim

Member

Registered: 2019-11-07

Posts: 2

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Hey Rob, I'm approaching this "NSFW" issue as "NSFS," Not Safe for Students. We love what you are providing for your users. We relied on Open Clip Art to send teachers and students to for their clip art images. While the images in question (actually that I flagged for you earlier) may not be considered "offensive" to the general public, but there are some that just aren't appropriate for students. As a school district, we must do our due diligence to protect students from inappropriate material- which often means we have to block well-intended sites.

So I guess that is at the heart of the issue- who is your intended audience? Teachers and students comprise a huge chunk of graphics users. Catering to their needs would certainly bolster traffic. But maybe that is not the direction you intend on taking the site.

As far as age verification- I would recommend having to log in to the site to see questionable content. If it's simply a checkbox, that would probably not meet due diligence standards for most school organizations to meet CIPA (Children's Internet Protection Act).

Probably 99% of your content doesn't even fall into this category. It would be sad to let a few NSFS/NSFW images prohibit that access and reduce traffic.

talljim

Member

Registered: 2019-11-07

Posts: 2

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Case in point, Rob- this is one of those that would cause us to have to block the whole site: https://freesvg.org/menage-a-trois

Agreed, and already flagged as inappropriate.

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Hi Jim, thanks for coming on board and joining the discussion, I should point out I am not affiliated with the site despite having moderator status. Just involved from it's inception. Let me quickly bring you up to speed with the orgins of the site, and it's founders. As you might be aware OCAL has been down for many months and after a long period of time the decision was made by the Developers, Boris & Vedran to launch a new site that would serve as a replacement for OCAL going forward, they have a number of other sites so were ideally suited to this and were up for the challenge.

The problem the community faced was the images that formed the OCAL collection were never released, and it was only recently FreeSVG were able to scrap OCAL site through command line scripting, to get their hand on the entire back catalogue. So what you see happening at present is in part an automated process, updating the site with images through image recognition software, and also there is a growing number of contributors manually adding files that cant be added automatically, from the OCAL collection.

The site is really only a couple of months old and has already come a long way in terms of development, as you are aware there is now a button for reporting issues with files. The cheque box I suggest, is in relation to the backend of the site, so for instance if you were to upload an image to the collection then what I propose is to add a check box to mark as being inappropriate for children, which would prevent some of the images making it to the home page, these images would only then be visable to registered users who have verified their age is above the imposed age limit.

Once the back catalogue has been fully processed, then the volume of offensive images should cease, but unfortunately, as it's a community driven site in the same way OCAL was, then to a certain degree contributors are expected to self moderate their contributions.

I share the same oppinion as yourself I would much rather serve the needs of the many, than cater to the few. But I think it may be possible to keep everyone happy if a solution can be found, the ultimate decision lies with the Webdevs who are aware of the situ, and are working on solutions.

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

there must be a reason the powers that be don't permit the publishing of childrens books that contain emoji flipping the bird,

I think this may need some more research, but https://www.bookdepository.com/Little-P … 4cQAvD_BwE

and I don't even recall seeing this type of emoji being available in android messaging either, so I trust they have done their homework.

Yes, about that...
https://www.techtimes.com/articles/9925 … id-svp.htm
https://emojipedia.org/google/android-1 … -extended/

Like I say, we will have to see what the WebDevs decide, some of the clipart posted recently from the back catalogue is bordering on Obscene and some may be seen as offensive to some, to so it's definitely something that needs to be tackled at some point.

Removing them from the collection would be the wrong way to go as almost everything can be seen as offensive to someone. I notice that some images are now flagged as they may be offensive to racists.

The problem of giving extremists the ability to remove any image they don't like is that it goes down a very slippery slope.

boris

Moderator

Registered: 2019-09-23

Posts: 19

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Removing them from the collection would be the wrong way to go as almost everything can be seen as offensive to someone. I notice that some images are now flagged as they may be offensive to racists.

The problem of giving extremists the ability to remove any image they don't like is that it goes down a very slippery slope.

I agree, we must set clear rules or guidelines what is and what is not offensive. In general I think any image showing open nudity, sexual acts are not child friendly and should be removed. But I also think political activism in form of provocative images and messages in any form should be banned not because I agree or not agree with them but because they may provoke similar images from the other side or give impression that we agree with such images and messages they send. It is difficult to be neutral and take a moral stance that does not fit everyone although all of us have these principles in our heads and live by them. That's why we do not have these rules so far but it is excellent topic for discussion. How to proceed, what to include or exclude? Are publishing rules of tech giants like Google or websites like Wikipedia way to go?

Links for discussion:

https://support.google.com/adsense/answer/9335564   Google Publisher Policies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism … ule-making   Criticism of Wikipedia

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Are publishing rules of tech giants like Google or websites like Wikipedia way to go?

Well, Wikipedia is not censored and Wikipedia:Offensive material may be a place to look.

A policy of appeasement may look appealing. Especially if it helps draw in clicks, but it may backfire and drive contributors away if the artistic freedom is limited by narrow minded bigots.

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Hi Liftarn, thanks for your involvement in this discussion, and your contributions so far, you are one of the sites most valued community members and you oppinion as well as your help in other areas is greatly appreciated.

First I must start with this, I read the description for this book, and it appears to be satirical in nature, and as the description states it is for adults, not children.
https://www.bookdepository.com/Little-P … 4cQAvD_BwE

I stand corrected and appear to be wrong about the emoji I probably should have fact checked but I am lazy, I checked my own phone prior to posting, which is fairly old now, and this does not contain this emoji, at lease not that I can see. One thing I will say though is that google they were late to embrace this, and only appear to have done so in response to public oppinion and also possibly due to IOS already supporting them, so by releasing them they are on a level playing field.

As I have stated if there is a solution that can be found that suites all, then this should consider in my oppinion, as it would be a shame for anything to be deleted:
"I share the same oppinion as yourself I would much rather serve the needs of the many, than cater to the few. But I think it may be possible to keep everyone happy if a solution can be found."

I have never written articals to wikipedia, but I assume some fact checking is done by someone other than the publisher of an artical so therefore the content is moderated, I have read what is written in the link you have provided and what they are stating appears to be a code of conduct, so basically they expecting publishers (editors) to self regulate themselves, in the same way this site operates to a certain extend.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia … e_material

Lastly, I am not going to link to this, but please search wikipedia for "the finger" the first couple of paragraphs explain all. And it's not suprising it was flagged as inappropriate given it's official published meaning.

I should come to my own defense by saying, I do not consider myself to be narrow minded as I always try to look for alternatives, and I think I am pretty accepting of others suggestions if they have value. And I am certainly not a biggot as I am currently aligning my views / oppinion with the community, if I were making the site just for me then I would have no objection to including everything, but this isn't in the community spirit.

It's not just about drawing clicks, although I am sure those do help, as it is partly an advertisement funded site. If this were the intention
then the case could be made that no moderation at all would bring in more visitors, sex sells after all along with anything else that is prohibited or restricted.

vedran

Moderator

Registered: 2019-09-21

Posts: 77

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

OK,for now all images reported as explicit content are accessible only if registered.
Also blur with watermark will be added to preview images.

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Might also want to consider something along the lines of:
what I propose is to add a check box to mark as being inappropriate for children, which would prevent some of the images making it to the home page, these images would only then be visable to registered users who have verified their age is above the imposed age limit.
And some age verification script so only registered users above a certain age gain access to those images.

vedran

Moderator

Registered: 2019-09-21

Posts: 77

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Yes
I'm looking in best practice solutions. This is just quick fix since we noticed lots of visits from schools.

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

OK,for now all images reported as explicit content are accessible only if registered.
Also blur with watermark will be added to preview images.

That seems to be open to abuse. If you can hide any image just by anonymously reporting it. I see that already now several images have been reported because someone disagreed with the political views. I hope a better system will be implemented.

liftarn

Member

Registered: 2019-10-09

Posts: 79

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

Might also want to consider something along the lines of:
what I propose is to add a check box to mark as being inappropriate for children, which would prevent some of the images making it to the home page,

If the judgement is in the hands of trusted admins that could work, but looking at the images that have been reported at https://freesvg.org/admin/report it seems none of them is really NSFW unless you consider things like the Voyager plaque to be pornography.

these images would only then be visable to registered users who have verified their age is above the imposed age limit.
And some age verification script so only registered users above a certain age gain access to those images.

I think that would be excessive. I think a better solution would be like Facebook have with a warning text and "Click to reveal".

rob_s

Moderator

Registered: 2019-10-04

Posts: 184

Re: [Feature] NSFW tag

I never came across that image but I seen other images that in my oppinion are completely innocent, I am noticing there is a potential for misuse of the report button, whether this be down to human error, people picking the wrong option, or a deliberate attempt by bad actors, it is something that could be exploited, I proposed moving it, making it accessible only to registered users, that way the culprit can be banned if it's malicious.

I have no further suggestions re NSFW or NSFS, the site has a duty of care obligation to all it's users, so I expect they will do the right thing.